Huky Forum
HUKY 500 (T, J, SOLID, PERF) => Roasting => Topic started by: boss99er on February 03, 2015, 08:58:36 PM
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When you guys get a new bean, do you have a default roast profile you use? Like, before you do any fine tuning, do you have something you follow. For instance:
40% power and 20% fan to 1C, then 25% power and 60% fan through 2C. I know thats super over simplified, but something to that effect?
I'm asking because since I'm coming from my Turbo Crazy, I have NO idea where to start with this thing. I'm excited to learn how this thing runs, and I know there will be a learning curve. I was given 10lbs of "junk" beans to season the drum and I figured I'll use some of them to screw with settings, but figured I'd ask on here from some of the more seasoned Huky users.
Thanks!!!
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Well, your proposed values are a bit oversimplified, but if you look up some of the Artisan graphs they have both power and fan adjustments in the bottom part. Personally I aim for a decreasing RateOfRise (RoR) which is also called DeltaBT in Artisan.
Else, I started out with the "Basic Roasting Intructions" found in the Resources area here. A very seasoned user at HomeBarista called "KFir" gave some excellent advice which should work right out of the box. However, I found the charge temps a bit high for my preference, so I charge at say 170C/340F for a 250-300g load. That gives me more "room to manouver" without stalling the roast at any point.
About the only adjustment I make at the moment is when I roast a dry-processed bean, where I try to start the roast a bit slower (longer drying phase), so that I get a more uniform result at the end. There is plenty more to learn and this forum is really a great resource for that.
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Oh yeah, I know those are very over simplified, that was only an example. I'll check out the "basic roasting instructions." i just need a little pushing off point to get going.
Thanks!
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I use a basic profile as a starting point but adjust depending on what type of bean I'm roasting. High grown/hard beans like Centrals, Columbians and Africans get a slightly higher charge temp and go faster to 325F. Softer/low grown beans like Sumatras, Sulawesis, Balis, etc., start at a lower temp (410F-ish). I found that using the same profile for a Sumatra as a Guat leads to a grassy tasting Sumatra.
A basic hard bean profile, for a pound, fast solid drum goes like this for me:
-charge around [BT[430F, fan 25%, IR stove at 2.5kPa
-at 300F-ish/dry point fan to 50% for 25 seconds then back to 25%
-at 325F stove to 3.25kPa
-at 365F stove to 1.0kPa
-at first crack stove to .5-75kPa
-at first crack end fan to 50%
You'll want to drop the beans at pretty much any point after first crack is over on up to second crack and even into second crack depending on what types of flavors you're looking for.
The same basic approach is used for the Indos that I love so much, just charge lower (410-ish)- that stretches things out enough to properly dry the beans so the unwelcome grassy overtones don't show up.
As you get used to the roaster and how it reacts you'll make adjustments on the fily. It won't take long, especially if you log your roasts and or take notes.
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Those "sweep beans" (junk beans) does come in handy to get started. Try to get two or three roasts going in a session. When things start to look good, roast a batch of better beans, so that you (possibly) can enjoy the fruit of your efforts. (A few days to a week of rest is needed for the roasted beans anyhow.) Then give it a day or two so that you have time to digest the experience. That mind process is equally important in the learning process.
... and do start with half loads, i.e. 225-300g. The Huky can easily manage a full 500g, but for learning 1/2# is easier to manage. I bought the Huky for the 500g capacity, but I seldom use that feature. The turn-around time from one roast to the next is much quicker with the Huky anyhow (compared to my old Gene Cafe).
I recieved my machine some three months ago and now I feel that I have some confidence, knowing that I will at least not ruin a roast.
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I use a basic profile as a starting point but adjust depending on what type of bean I'm roasting. High grown/hard beans like Centrals, Columbians and Africans get a slightly higher charge temp and go faster to 325F. Softer/low grown beans like Sumatras, Sulawesis, Balis, etc., start at a lower temp (410F-ish). I found that using the same profile for a Sumatra as a Guat leads to a grassy tasting Sumatra.
A basic hard bean profile, for a pound, fast solid drum goes like this for me:
-charge around [BT[430F, fan 25%, IR stove at 2.5kPa
-at 300F-ish/dry point fan to 50% for 25 seconds then back to 25%
-at 325F stove to 3.25kPa
-at 365F stove to 1.0kPa
-at first crack stove to .5-75kPa
-at first crack end fan to 50%
You'll want to drop the beans at pretty much any point after first crack is over on up to second crack and even into second crack depending on what types of flavors you're looking for.
The same basic approach is used for the Indos that I love so much, just charge lower (410-ish)- that stretches things out enough to properly dry the beans so the unwelcome grassy overtones don't show up.
As you get used to the roaster and how it reacts you'll make adjustments on the fily. It won't take long, especially if you log your roasts and or take notes.
Awesome Greg!!! This is exactly what I was looking for! Much appreciated!
Those "sweep beans" (junk beans) does come in handy to get started. Try to get two or three roasts going in a session. When things start to look good, roast a batch of better beans, so that you (possibly) can enjoy the fruit of your efforts. (A few days to a week of rest is needed for the roasted beans anyhow.) Then give it a day or two so that you have time to digest the experience. That mind process is equally important in the learning process.
... and do start with half loads, i.e. 225-300g. The Huky can easily manage a full 500g, but for learning 1/2# is easier to manage. I bought the Huky for the 500g capacity, but I seldom use that feature. The turn-around time from one roast to the next is much quicker with the Huky anyhow (compared to my old Gene Cafe).
I recieved my machine some three months ago and now I feel that I have some confidence, knowing that I will at least not ruin a roast.
Good advice, thanks! So you're saying I should roast maybe 2-3 junk roasts back to back my first time firing it up, and then do another roast of better beans? Its funny.....I've been roasting on my TurboCrazy for a couple years, but I'm as nervous about using the Huky as I was for my very first roast. I guess essentially, I AM starting over. GOOD TIMES!!!
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Good advice, thanks! So you're saying I should roast maybe 2-3 junk roasts back to back my first time firing it up, and then do another roast of better beans? Its funny.....I've been roasting on my TurboCrazy for a couple years, but I'm as nervous about using the Huky as I was for my very first roast. I guess essentially, I AM starting over. GOOD TIMES!!!
Yes, see to that you get the hang of it first. I don't know about the TurboCrazy, but the Gene was about setting the temp and watching for the end point. With the Huky you have to learn to control the roaster and also learn how to roast. I've had my Huky for three months now and I'm just starting to feel that I can get a decent roast out of it on most occations. But there's a great distance from "decent" to "excellent", even though it may just be a slight adjustment somewhere in the roast... The thing is to learn from what happens and to expand from that.
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Yeah, with the TC you basically turn it on, and wait for the level of roast you want to get reached. I'm a super nerd about numbers and stats, so I'm assuming I'll REALLY enjoy this thing! Hopefully I'll be able to eventually kick out excellent roasts!
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Just wanted to pop in and share that I've been getting some great (SO espresso) results for the last several roasts using a formula based on the adjustments I added earlier in the thread-- but I'm adding what I think is one of the key timings: a 3:15 development stage. It boils down to 4 minutes to dry (roughly 290-300F), 4 more minutes to first crack and then 3:15 til the end of the roast. This has led to a whole lotta espresso heaven. The beans were Guatemala, Cameroon, Viet Nam and Rwanda- very similar timings for each one. Also did a Sulawesi but with slightly longer dry and ramp times, same 3:15 development though.
Try it you'll like it :)
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Just to be clear I'm recommending dropping the beans 3:15 after first crack starts, but that is quite a bit short of second crack. This is a roast I did yesterday- went as planned (4/4/3:15). That was still a ways away from second crack- 30-45 seconds approximately.
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Hey Gregr, I just wanted to pop in and let ya know I tried my first couple roasts on the Huky tonight! I roasted the beans WAYYY longer than I normally would, toward the end of SC so I could get the beans nice and oily to "season" the drum. I did however use your suggested default profile, just to get some practice. I feel like the roast developed pretty decently. Here is how it went:
Charge @ 410F
Turn Around @ 1:50 and 235F
Dry @ 3:45 and 300F
FC Start @ 7:00 and 398F
FC Finish @ 8:45
SC Start @ 10:45
Dumped somewhere around 12:45 at 470F
Normally I would have stopped my roast about a min after FC ends.....but that wasnt the point of this roast. Tomorrow I'll be roasting some beans to drink. I'm thinking I'll roast some Ethiopian Yerg for my first drinkable roast in the Huky. I love how much control you have with this thing! On my second roast, I just messed with the fans and heat to see how easily I could manipulate the ROR, etc. I likely wont start using Artisan until I really get comfortable with the process of the Huky. There's enough moving around and adjusting for now. Awesome little roaster though!!!
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Here's mine for 1lb charge-solid drum-72rpm
(2:00 to 3:00 RD time)
0:00/ Drop in at 200c /50mmaq /low air
1:30 / 80-90c / 4kpa / low air
5:00 / 150c / 3kpa / low air (100% air bump every min or 10*c)
160c / 2kpa / low air
170c / 1kpa / low air
180c / .75kpa / 50% air
190c / .50kpa-.75kpa / 50% air
200c / .50kpa / 70% air / 1st crack begins- BT & ET should be fairly close by now
Adjust heat up if necessary-follow RD plan & finish temp. range
(Tilt roaster and TRY to get the stray beans out after drop)
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Makes perfect sense. :) Behmor isn't doing a declining RoR, but I found it amusing it matches up well (well, within seconds anyway) of the Behmor 'Rosetta'. Would you say your 4/4/3:15 results in a solid FC?
Good question- that's one of those vague definitions, like dry time. I think of FC as being just before second crack starts and 3:15 leaves anywhere from 30 to 75ish seconds before second so I call it FC-.
boss99er- excellent! Glad to hear things went predictably for you. Interesting to note that your turn around time was about 10 seconds longer but 10-20F higher than what I generally see. And then you went pretty fast to first crack- that may have led to a really nuanced bright and fruity drink (depending on the beans of course), but regardless- to be able to get that kind of speed... it's a beauteeful thing :) When you get to the good stuff I think you'll be tasting some flavors that a lot of roasters miss out on.
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boss99er- excellent! Glad to hear things went predictably for you. Interesting to note that your turn around time was about 10 seconds longer but 10-20F higher than what I generally see. And then you went pretty fast to first crack- that may have led to a really nuanced bright and fruity drink (depending on the beans of course), but regardless- to be able to get that kind of speed... it's a beauteeful thing :) When you get to the good stuff I think you'll be tasting some flavors that a lot of roasters miss out on.
I hope you're right! I'll follow those same parameters today with good beans and see what I get. I'll post my results. Thanks again for the suggestions!
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Hey Gregr,
Here are my results from tonight. I think it went great!
Ethiopian Kaffa 300g
Charge @ 400F
TA @ 1:43 and 217F
Dry @ 4:18 and 300F
FC @ 7:45 and 394F
End FC @ 10:00 and 425F
Dump @ 11:15 and 435F
Start Weight 300g - End Weight 251.5
Loss 16.2%
I was really cruising through FC so I played with the air a bit and turned my heat down to around .25 Kpa. My ROR slowed nicely and really let me extend the FC a little and extended the roast to my dump temp.
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That's great- I hope you get some great shots from that roast. Everything happened just a tad quicker than what I see with a full pound. Based on that I know what to do next time I want to roast a smaller amount :)
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That's great- I hope you get some great shots from that roast. Everything happened just a tad quicker than what I see with a full pound. Based on that I know what to do next time I want to roast a smaller amount :)
Now hopefully it tastes as good as it looks on paper!
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>FC @ 7:45 and 394F
>End FC @ 10:00 and 425F
>Dump @ 11:15 and 435F
The two minutes and fifteen seconds first crack, along with the 31F temp change is long and big but I have a feeling you just determined the end of first crack was when the very last pop was heard. This is another one of those subjective calls- but I think most people call it when the pops dissipate to 'almost done' and there are always a few, or more, late pops. I generally see first crack times of 1:15-1:45, with a 15F-ish temp rise, not that that means a whole lot being so subjective.
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>FC @ 7:45 and 394F
>End FC @ 10:00 and 425F
>Dump @ 11:15 and 435F
The two minutes and fifteen seconds first crack, along with the 31F temp change is long and big but I have a feeling you just determined the end of first crack was when the very last pop was heard. This is another one of those subjective calls- but I think most people call it when the pops dissipate to 'almost done' and there are always a few, or more, late pops. I generally see first crack times of 1:15-1:45, with a 15F-ish temp rise, not that that means a whole lot being so subjective.
Yeah, on this roast you're 100% correct. I was actually looking at my previous notes and suddenly realized the "cracking" had slowed down to almost nothing. I normally call FC start at the beginning of rapid cracking and the end of FC when it slows. So.....I guess just try to disregard that a little on this roast. :-) All other parameters were pretty much dead on to what I would like, so I think my FC time and temp are my erroneous record keeping this time.
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Oh man.....Gregr, I just realized something today. The default roast profile you recommended to me was for 1lb of greens. For some reason, I had in my head you recommended 300g. No wonder I've been FLYING through the roast with those settings! I've been putting 300g roasts through with that profile.
In other news, my variac arrived today!
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Hah! And the roaster is brand new super clean- so everything makes sense and you're on the right track. Looking forward to hearing some cupping notes from your next roast :)
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Hah! And the roaster is brand new super clean- so everything makes sense and you're on the right track. Looking forward to hearing some cupping notes from your next roast :)
Ha ha, sounds good! I just cant wait to be able to write down solid numbers for fan control with this variac instead of "about half way" or "a little less/more than half way" for my profiling.
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For the first time my default profile failed. I don't think it's the profile's fault though- this coffee may just be too bright to make a decent shot out of. It's Kenya Kianjege- profile below. It was slightly slower than what I was aiming for because I did a dumb thing and forgot to start the drum turning til only a few seconds before I put the beans in. Shoulda just waited but on the bright side (no pun intended...) now I know how much that mistake sets back the roast.
I tried a couple shots this morning, 18g dose/25g shot and 18/20. Both were so bright and lemon-y they were just not good at all. There was some nice bittersweet chocoloate flavor there but it was dominated by over the top citrus brightness. Usually I like that but this was too much. Will try again tomorrow but most likely this will be Vacpot material.
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I just re-read the notes on this coffee and wow- I sure botched that one because this sounds like a great coffee.
http://www.happymugcoffee.com/african/328-kenya-kianjege-green-coffee.html
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I just re-read the notes on this coffee and wow- I sure botched that one because this sounds like a great coffee.
http://www.happymugcoffee.com/african/328-kenya-kianjege-green-coffee.html
That DOES sound good. You'll dial it in!